(03-05-2021, 07:53 AM)Sniffer Dog Wrote: Interesting point this:

When Brighton were promoted under Hughton they failed to score in just 7 of their 46 league games.

They also scored 3 or more goals in 13 of their 46 league games.

(03-05-2021, 11:42 AM)PsychoStanleyStone Wrote: in 2015/16, Hughtons first full season, Brighton scored the joint most goals in the league 72, accumulated 89 points and only missed out on automatic by goal differance of 2, losing out to Karanka's Boro

extremely impressive, but raises questions like where did it go wrong this season, oh yeh we blame the players and delight at the stability

(05-05-2021, 12:16 PM)Tricky Wrote:

(03-05-2021, 11:42 AM)PsychoStanleyStone Wrote: in 2015/16, Hughtons first full season, Brighton scored the joint most goals in the league 72, accumulated 89 points and only missed out on automatic by goal differance of 2, losing out to Karanka's Boro

extremely impressive, but raises questions like where did it go wrong this season, oh yeh we blame the players and delight at the stability

Firstly, Hughton hasn't yet had a full season at the club, so hasnt yet had a chance to build the side that he wants. He has been forced to use the squad that he inherited, which we all acknowledge was an absolute mish mash of individuals, some of whom had lost all confidence as a result of the end of last seasons collapse.

So do we blame Hughton for all of the individual errors that cost us goals this season which cost us more points than we realise? Do we blame Hughton for our attack missing sitters (and no I am not just blaming Grabban, but including the likes of Yates, Knockaert, Krovinovich etc), which would have won us more points than we would care to admit? Was it Hughton that was playing poor passing all over the pitch throughout the majority of games this season, you know, that fundamental basic skill first taught at primary school? No! It was the players. I am pretty damned certain that if Hughton had a squad full of players of his choosing and not what he had inherited, the majority of the side he was picking would not have been in the matchday squad let alone playing week in week out. He worked with what he had got, that's all he could do!

You seem to have some kind of bee in your bonnet about stability at the club? Would you be happier if we went down the Phillipe Montanier route again, hoping we outscore the opponents and winning matches 4-3 or losing them 4-3? If we adopt that approach again, then we will be in L1. Or would you rather we were as stable as our neighbours down the A52? I am sure their fans would happily swap places with us for the stability of their club for the stability of ours.

Would you be happier with another Fawaz type of owner running things? Or have you forgotten just how dangerously close our club was to going bust as a result of the instability it found itself in? 

Yes, I accept that things could be done better on and off the field. But I am prepared to give Hughton the benefit of the doubt with a full pre-season and season to see where we do actually stand. It is all well and good quoting Hughton's full seasons in charge at Brighton and at Newcastle, but you have to be honest and add that his first season in charge of those clubs was to stabilise them and avoid the threat of relegation, which did include some defensive and dour football. It would also appear that our CEO has also been listening to fans concerns about his involvement and interferences with the playing side of things and has taken a step back.

There is only one way Forest have not adopted yet in order to try and achieve promotion back to the PL and that is by being patient and stable in all departments. Chopping and changing managers for no reason, buying in past their sell by date players for hefty fees and wages have not worked, throwing good money after bad in terms of sacking managers and buying average quality players on a whim has not worked, yet we have done this time and time again over the past 22 years. All of those years of instability, and yes! they have been unstable years.

Maybe now is the right time to accept that we, as a club, have been going down the wrong route and now is the time to try something different, something the fans haven't experienced in years, something that seemed to work rather well when Forest were an actual force to be reckoned with. Stability from the top down

(05-05-2021, 12:16 PM)Tricky Wrote:

(03-05-2021, 11:42 AM)PsychoStanleyStone Wrote: in 2015/16, Hughtons first full season, Brighton scored the joint most goals in the league 72, accumulated 89 points and only missed out on automatic by goal differance of 2, losing out to Karanka's Boro

extremely impressive, but raises questions like where did it go wrong this season, oh yeh we blame the players and delight at the stability

Firstly, Hughton hasn't yet had a full season at the club, so hasnt yet had a chance to build the side that he wants. He has been forced to use the squad that he inherited, which we all acknowledge was an absolute mish mash of individuals, some of whom had lost all confidence as a result of the end of last seasons collapse.

So do we blame Hughton for all of the individual errors that cost us goals this season which cost us more points than we realise? Do we blame Hughton for our attack missing sitters (and no I am not just blaming Grabban, but including the likes of Yates, Knockaert, Krovinovich etc), which would have won us more points than we would care to admit? Was it Hughton that was playing poor passing all over the pitch throughout the majority of games this season, you know, that fundamental basic skill first taught at primary school? No! It was the players. I am pretty damned certain that if Hughton had a squad full of players of his choosing and not what he had inherited, the majority of the side he was picking would not have been in the matchday squad let alone playing week in week out. He worked with what he had got, that's all he could do!

You seem to have some kind of bee in your bonnet about stability at the club? Would you be happier if we went down the Phillipe Montanier route again, hoping we outscore the opponents and winning matches 4-3 or losing them 4-3? If we adopt that approach again, then we will be in L1. Or would you rather we were as stable as our neighbours down the A52? I am sure their fans would happily swap places with us for the stability of their club for the stability of ours.

Would you be happier with another Fawaz type of owner running things? Or have you forgotten just how dangerously close our club was to going bust as a result of the instability it found itself in? 

Yes, I accept that things could be done better on and off the field. But I am prepared to give Hughton the benefit of the doubt with a full pre-season and season to see where we do actually stand. It is all well and good quoting Hughton's full seasons in charge at Brighton and at Newcastle, but you have to be honest and add that his first season in charge of those clubs was to stabilise them and avoid the threat of relegation, which did include some defensive and dour football. It would also appear that our CEO has also been listening to fans concerns about his involvement and interferences with the playing side of things and has taken a step back.

There is only one way Forest have not adopted yet in order to try and achieve promotion back to the PL and that is by being patient and stable in all departments. Chopping and changing managers for no reason, buying in past their sell by date players for hefty fees and wages have not worked, throwing good money after bad in terms of sacking managers and buying average quality players on a whim has not worked, yet we have done this time and time again over the past 22 years. All of those years of instability, and yes! they have been unstable years.

Maybe now is the right time to accept that we, as a club, have been going down the wrong route and now is the time to try something different, something the fans haven't experienced in years, something that seemed to work rather well when Forest were an actual force to be reckoned with. Stability from the top down

(05-05-2021, 02:01 PM)wassy04 Wrote:

(05-05-2021, 12:16 PM)Tricky Wrote:

(03-05-2021, 11:42 AM)PsychoStanleyStone Wrote: in 2015/16, Hughtons first full season, Brighton scored the joint most goals in the league 72, accumulated 89 points and only missed out on automatic by goal differance of 2, losing out to Karanka's Boro

extremely impressive, but raises questions like where did it go wrong this season, oh yeh we blame the players and delight at the stability

Firstly, Hughton hasn't yet had a full season at the club, so hasnt yet had a chance to build the side that he wants. He has been forced to use the squad that he inherited    Stability from the top down

I do think there is finally a growing acceptance that maybe, MAYBE our players just aren't that good and that it's not every single failed manager's fault.

(05-05-2021, 04:55 PM)PsychoStanleyStone Wrote:

(05-05-2021, 02:01 PM)wassy04 Wrote:

(05-05-2021, 12:16 PM)Tricky Wrote:

(03-05-2021, 11:42 AM)PsychoStanleyStone Wrote: in 2015/16, Hughtons first full season, Brighton scored the joint most goals in the league 72, accumulated 89 points and only missed out on automatic by goal differance of 2, losing out to Karanka's Boro

extremely impressive, but raises questions like where did it go wrong this season, oh yeh we blame the players and delight at the stability

Firstly, Hughton hasn't yet had a full season at the club, so hasnt yet had a chance to build the side that he wants. He has been forced to use the squad that he inherited    Stability from the top down

I do think there is finally a growing acceptance that maybe, MAYBE our players just aren't that good and that it's not every single failed manager's fault.

i was going to say i don't mind but unfortunately i do and at this moment in time Hughton just hasn't done enough for me this season, doesn't neccessarily mean he can't be a huge hit next season though, but this season has done nothing for Hughton's credibility really

I think managers have to have the ability to get an inherited team firing and winning, he did the spade work at the start and then started picking up points but then we just levelled out at low level mediocre

i guess if he had tried many, many differant things and player combinations he would risk attracting criticism but to be honest he didn't really try anything at all, he is a believer in sameness

things that showed glimmers like players making an impact from the bench like Knocky, Murphy and Grabban, he didn't persevere with, he went back to starting them and in my opinion lost the edge an experienced pro can bring to the team from the bench, these guys are fit but they have an edge played later and some if not the majority of there impact was from the bench but Hughton likes sameness, 90 min gruellers where players get tired and lose there class.

Overall Hughton is good for opposition managers because it is easy to predict the set up and style and emphasis when really the managers job is to have a paradigm parrellel view of strategy and detail and ways to win, this is the concern, he hasn't shown an ounce of tactical astuteness, even then for every ounce of astuteness big nogs of clumsy predictable reactionary dross plops

a fluid volatile environment of liquid change would be more beneficial, even no manager or Brazil or some maverick would be no worse than what i have seen this season

i think he had a perfect storm at Brighton, good players, good everything and it all came together, depends on the clearout but our set up still seems a bit poisonous/big floundering giant syndrome/player power/whispers in corriders whatever these are beyond the scope of the managers job

I'm disillusioned generally and Hughton has grossly disappointed and noone speaks truths really anymore or gets upset and Hughton is the same dull personality every game towing the party line and goes nowhere near anything vaguely controversial

If you can only change 1 thing you change the manager, if you can change everything i think manager goes either way

(05-05-2021, 05:50 PM)TrickySte Wrote: It's funny how perceptions change. Last October I kept reading that it was the best transfer window we'd ever had & the strongest squad we'd had in years .

(05-05-2021, 08:30 PM)wassy04 Wrote:

(05-05-2021, 05:50 PM)TrickySte Wrote: It's funny how perceptions change. Last October I kept reading that it was the best transfer window we'd ever had & the strongest squad we'd had in years .

That was not my opinion, I felt the transfers were necessary and was hopeful about the signings of Taylor and Mckenna. However was painfully aware of the loss of our two best players and the fact that we overacheived the season before.

We needed an overhaul last summer to improve however it failed. So now we're in the same boat again, at least we have Johnson and mighten to add to the mix

(05-05-2021, 05:46 PM)ozzyten10 Wrote: Hughtons Credibility? Let’s ask Derby fans if they wished they had Hughton! When he arrived we had come off a shocking run of defeats - conceding for fun and not scoring. He has steadied the ship and improved the side to be the worst defensively in the league after 4 games to 5th. He hasn’t sorted the scoring out but the better sides a always built from the back and have a defensive stability. We have stayed up comfortably. Granted it has been a shocking season but his additions did all have an impact and I trust him more than previous managers to get it right. I’m hoping for a playoff challenge next year and I trust we will be much better. I hope he gets time…