The Infrastructure Projects

[Salvatore Matrecano]

Added to my post above - look at the amount of people writhin an hours drive of Toton - it brings South Yorkshire, Derbyshire and parts of Leicester and West Midlands within it.
Within London there is loads of competition yet spurs Arsenal and Wembley all have great revenue from their stadiums.
The lack of competition to host such events in the midlands (especially East Midlands) means that we could be onto a real winner here. If we don’t do it - someone else will.
We just can’t do it on our current site - unless it is enlarged - knocking down the streets behind the brifgford, the boat houses and at a push the environment agency building and we may have scope - but how much would that cost? As well as the freeholds? I’d guess much more than the Toronto site.

1. Just because Toton is in the middle of a lot of places doesnt mean the good people of Derbys and SYorks will become Forest supporters.
2. There are loads of established venues in the wider area, many underused.
3. London is a totally different scenario. There is less demand here.
4. It will cost a fortune and take about 10 years to complete.
5. Do all of the above and become stinking rich, its still unlikely Forest become a “big club”. We weren’t even when lifting European cups. Big clubs belong to big cities and Nottingham isn’t one.
6. Chelsea recently became European champions with a capacity of 40k. Forest did it with 30k years back. We will still develop the CG even if not perfect.
7. Clubs that lose their identity become irrelevant, move 7 miles out the community we represent, we lose everything in my opinion. Go an visit the Coventry Building Society arena or the Select Car Leasing Stadium, Reading if you don’t believe me. Yes those are the correct names for those abominations. But hey, they both get loads of commercial revenue.
8. What has any of the above got to do with 11 blokes in red kicking a football which is what I care about.

[ToryTom]

Added to my post above - look at the amount of people writhin an hours drive of Toton - it brings South Yorkshire, Derbyshire and parts of Leicester and West Midlands within it.
Within London there is loads of competition yet spurs Arsenal and Wembley all have great revenue from their stadiums.
The lack of competition to host such events in the midlands (especially East Midlands) means that we could be onto a real winner here. If we don’t do it - someone else will.
We just can’t do it on our current site - unless it is enlarged - knocking down the streets behind the brifgford, the boat houses and at a push the environment agency building  and we may have scope - but how much would that cost? As well as the freeholds? I’d guess much more than the Toronto site.

1. Just because Toton is in the middle of a lot of places doesnt mean the good people of Derbys and SYorks will become Forest supporters.
2. There are loads of established venues in the wider area, many underused.
3. London is a totally different scenario. There is less demand here.
4. It will cost a fortune and take about 10 years to complete.
5. Do all of the above and become stinking rich, its still unlikely Forest become a “big club”. We weren’t even when lifting European cups. Big clubs belong to big cities and Nottingham isn’t one.
6. Chelsea recently became European champions with a capacity of 40k. Forest did it with 30k years back. We will still develop the CG even if not perfect.
7. Clubs that lose their identity become irrelevant, move 7 miles out the community we represent, we lose everything in my opinion. Go an visit the Coventry Building Society arena or the Select Car Leasing Stadium, Reading if you don’t believe me. Yes those are the correct names for those abominations. But hey, they both get loads of commercial revenue.
8. What has any of the above got to do with 11 blokes in red kicking a football which is what I care about.

Nottingham urban area is the 9th largest in the uk. just behind Newcastle who happen to have a 50,000 + stadium and looking into moving into an even bigger one and the big change coming is football expenditure linked to income. To get more income we need a much bigger multi use stadium. Nothing guaranteed this will make us succesful but it improves our chances. Football crowds have risen significantly since we were champions. The population of Nottingham has increased significantly. In division 1 we were getting crowds of 20,000 + and sometimes sell out. Every match at the city ground has been sold out for 3 years. we have 20,000 season ticket holders which has been limited and 12,000 paying to go on. a waiting list. We can fill a much bigger stadium and will need to if we want to compete at the top level in the years to come. we have an ambitious  owner and very lucky to have him. I am struggling to understand why some of the fan base don’t want those ambitions.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

I do have mate. I simply don’t want to go to Toton.
To be clear Toton would be more convenient for me, I would be able to walk to the stadium. But I have seen enough out of town developments to know that moving there would rip the heart out of the club.
Ideally we rip the CG down and rebuild on site. If not we do it in stages as per the 2019 plan we have dawdled on for 5 years now.

[DR Forest]

Why are you all arguing?
I remain convinced the plan is, and always has been, to build 45/50k stadium at the CG.
I said it a few days ago on another thread and sniffer’s ‘news’ comes as no surprise whatsoever.
However, the club needs a bigger footprint to do this and recent media volleys have just been shaking that tree to elicit NCC’s compliance with that.

We aren’t going to Toton; but the training ground might.

[Uwantlee]

It's all ifs, buts and maybes at the moment and no point falling out. I don't think anyone would disagree that we all want to stay where we are... More than anything. This is now up to those that run the club and I for one trust them to do the right thing. If we can stay, increase the capacity, build the infrastructure and be a world brand then perfect... If we can't and it needs to happen somewhere else the people who know far more about it than us will make the decision.

We are coming to a point in our history where more and more fans have known nothing other than abject failure and mediocrity. Some of us remember league cups and European nights... So those people... Do they feel the same. Will the next generation feel the same about the CG. We will always have those memories.

I'd love to remain at the CG. I'd love us to be a success again. I'd love my kids to feel what I felt.

[ozzyten10]

My first game as a 5 year old was a euro cup match sat on the girder at the back of the Trent end. Japanese sub sinks forest was the headline. I can’t remember much else other than that was my ‘seat’ for the next 8 years. I saw brilliant players: from Robertson to shringham in that stand. Then had to move. Had a hiatus for a few years - was there for the frank clarke side when I could get back from uni. Then suffered for years travelling from afar.
I hate change but if one thing in life that is constant- it’s change!
I do believe they want to stay. I don’t think it’s viable for what they want to do.

[Salvatore Matrecano]

My first game as a 5 year old was a euro cup match sat on the girder at the back of the Trent end. Japanese sub sinks forest was the headline. I can’t remember much else other than that was my ‘seat’ for the next 8 years. I saw brilliant players: from Robertson to shringham in that stand. Then had to move. Had a hiatus for a few years - was there for the frank clarke side when I could get back from uni. Then suffered for years travelling from afar.
I hate change but if one thing in life that is constant- it’s change!
I do believe they want to stay. I don’t think it’s viable for what they want to do.

Thats fair enough Ozzy and I wasn’t picking a fight with you in particular above.
Yes change is inevitable and indeed needed, it just needs to be the right change.
If Toton is a red herring and a tool to play the council as has been suggested well fair enough and we've got ourselves in a lather for nothing, hope that’s the case.

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

Why are you all arguing?
I remain convinced the plan is, and always has been, to build 45/50k stadium at the CG.
I said it a few days ago on another thread and sniffer’s ‘news’ comes as no surprise whatsoever.
However, the club needs a bigger footprint to do this and recent media volleys have just been shaking that tree to elicit NCC’s compliance with that.

We aren’t going to Toton; but the training ground might.

This ^^

I will 100% take this option if it is doable over any new stadium.

Just imagine walking in a circle around a new bowl of a stadium passing all those multi nationals like Vodafone, Zara, H&M, Macdonalds, KFC etc. Is that what you want just so we can make a bit more income each season. Just the thought of it makes me want to vomit.

[DR Forest]

I don’t think Toton is a complete red herring SM- we may end up with training and maybe conference facilities there.
.
Taking a step back, isn’t it convenient all this tit for tat has been a useful litmus test for both the club and the council (Even if not originally by design)?
Remember, the fans are ‘customers’ of both and I think it’s focused minds on both sides by forcing the issue to be dealt with.

Then, I just think about the end game here.
Fact- popular opinion and (costs aside) the best location for all is to stay where we are;
Fact- nothing is guaranteed but to have any realistic chance of competing at the very top level we need to develop the stadium and commercial revenue.
Fact- to do both these, we need better infrastructure (eg car parks and roads as well as physical seats) and this needs more space.

Now both parties seem to accept the will of the people they just might actually work together to make it happen.

I don’t want to move but for me, having the income to compete trumps the romance of staying put IF a resolution at NG2 can’t be found.

I too recall those European nights as a little boy; and whilst some, who may not have witnessed those moments on the field, cling to the connective tissue that is the world famous CG, I can tell them that such moments on the pitch far far outweigh any feel-good factor walking over Trent bridge admiring the river.

I want more great days before I’m gone; we hope to stay but if the best chance of experiencing those days again means moving, then so be it.

[ToryTom]

I don’t think Toton is a complete red herring SM- we may end up with training and maybe conference facilities there.
.
Taking a step back, isn’t it convenient all this tit for tat has been a useful litmus test for both the club and the council (Even if not originally by design)?
Remember, the fans are ‘customers’ of both and I think it’s focused minds on both sides by forcing the issue to be dealt with.

Then, I just think about the end game here.
Fact- popular opinion and (costs aside) the best location for all is to stay where we are;
Fact- nothing is guaranteed but to have any realistic chance of competing at the very top level we need to develop the stadium and commercial revenue.
Fact- to do both these, we need better infrastructure (eg car parks and roads as well as physical seats) and this needs more space.

Now both parties seem to accept the will of the people they just might actually work together to make it happen.

I don’t want to move but for me, having the income to compete trumps the romance of staying put IF a resolution at NG2 can’t be found.

I too recall those European nights as a little boy; and whilst some, who may not have witnessed those moments on the field, cling to the connective tissue that is the world famous CG, I can tell them that such moments on the pitch far far outweigh any feel-good factor walking over Trent bridge admiring the river.

I want more great days before I’m gone; we hope to stay but if the best chance of experiencing those days again means moving, then so be it.

That sums it for me too.

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

There is some talk now about that large piece of land close to the Memorial Gardens on the Embankment, next to and perhaps even including those football pitches.

Now that could be a winner that keeps everybody happy.

[BomberBowyer]

There is some talk now about that large piece of land close to the Memorial Gardens on the Embankment, next to and perhaps even including those football pitches.

Now that could be a winner that keeps everybody happy.

Now that wouldn’t be a bad shout. Possibly large enough for new stadium and training facilities and decent space for access. Less impact on businesses in and around the current ground as well as still within walking distance. Whilst would love to stay at the City Ground this could an excellent alternative.

The possible only negative is that land i believe is currently used for grass roots games so where would those teams play? Or could that be an opportunity to increase revenue or put back into the community by those teams being allowed to use some of our training pitches ?‍♂️