Tactics Formations & Team Selections Etc

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

I have created this thread because I am fed up of other threads getting derailed.

We have a great transfer thread for example that is being ruined with non transfer talk :@

So here you can now fill yer boots with tactics, formations and team selections etc.

Rant over.

[Tricky]

I have created this thread because I am fed up of other threads getting derailed.

We have a great transfer thread for example that is being ruined with non transfer talk :@

So here you can now fill yer boots with tactics, formations and team selections etc.

Rant over.

I love it when Sniff gets rattled  :D

[Sniffer Dog (Admin)]

People should appreciate the fact that this forum is monitored.

If it wasn't then it would end up like Vital.

Nobody deserves that do they?

[PsychoStanleyStone]

having a few variations of tactics, formations and use the squad as much as possible, i'm telling ya we'd be top ut league now

Hughton's got 70% right, the players all seem up for it, youngsters and new signing exceeding expectations

more so last season but even now i'm a firm believer in a theory that a player can be prolific for 15 or 30 minutes off the bench, mighten, back, fornah, Carv may not hit the required levels over 90 mins but could overload expectations over 15 mins or half hour, the game plan should even prepare in this way

Grabbans most scintillating effect was later on against Sheff Wed last season, this fella was a 1 man tsunami, coming off the bench against a tiring and disillusioned opponent and he looked like a £20m player, just an example but i just see all players can play a part, even win games from the bench when over 90 minutes it is psychologically tough and doesn't always suit

this also more than any looks like being a development, make do and mend even, season

at the moment all we have is the template, which is tried and tested, even myself view it as failing but this incorrect, it is working, it gets us into games, ahead in games and back into games, it works but a much wider deployment of tactic variants and personnel needs infusing as and when, this is for the manager to make the calls in games, but unfortunately ours doesn't

end of this debate, thanks, over and out

*this is only a theory, not really seen it put into practice much, this isn't about desperation last 3 minutes of the game sort of substitution or even worse and hate the 'running down the clock' stuff as well, i want to see sweeping changes if required and we've all seen the need, haven't we .. even only 2 games in

[andy1236660]

Couple of points from the Bournmouth game. Fingers have been pointed at the full backs and keeper for the goals but both were the result of poor play as a team. In the first, the ball moved from their keeper to the the back of the net in four or five passes without us getting close to any of their player. The second was similar, you can't stop goals if you don't track runners and leave your full back exposed.

Compare this with Bournemouth's pressing. Time and again, Figueredo gave Gabriel the ball, leaving him with no option but to boot it down the line. Time and again he was closed down and caught in possession. Compare that to the Bradford game whether central midfielders usually Fornah, would cone deep to get the ball. Back usually had time to check out his options - he'd check back if nothing was on and find a pass I'd one was available. There was nowhere near enough pressure but they were working the ball far more intelligently.

Some of this is down to personnel. Figueredo is poor in possession and Gabriel isn't ready yet but the lack of urgency and movement feels like a wider issue.

Finally, Johnson was disappointing but his best moments so far, including some fine crosses, have all come when he's been wide on the right. I see him more as an inside forward or winger than a number 10.

[PsychoStanleyStone]

Couple of points from the Bournmouth game. Fingers have been pointed at the full backs and keeper for the goals but both were the result of poor play as a team. 

Figueredo is poor in possession and Gabriel isn't ready yet but the lack of urgency and movement feels like a wider issue.

once again, the template gameplan sort of works but opponents know we are set up to invite pressure, Bournemouth and potentially many other teams just do their homework now, we are ok hoping opponents sideways pass around the area and stick in hit n hope crosses and we look sound but high tempo quality moves leave half our team flat footed

[Strawberry Avenger]

People should appreciate the fact that this forum is monitored.

If it wasn't then it would end up like Vital.

Nobody deserves that do they?

Quite so.

On topic.

Tactics.  4.2.3.1 seems to be the fashion.  Southgate deploying basically the same thing to compensate for England's lack of 'Italian Love' on the ball.

Similarly, Hughton deploys it in the absence of quality recruitment.  He may well have used it at Brighton and Newcastle where both teams scored loads of goals.

My ultimate view is one of deference to Brian Clough.  'A lot of nonsense is talked about formations.  Players win you games.'

And Forest don't have enough quality players.  As the last two results proved.

It really is quite that simple.

SA.

[Paplane]

I have created this thread because I am fed up of other threads getting derailed.

We have a great transfer thread for example that is being ruined with non transfer talk :@

So here you can now fill yer boots with tactics, formations and team selections etc.

Rant over.

Yeah but are there any signings imminent Sniff?

[Paplane]

People should appreciate the fact that this forum is monitored.

If it wasn't then it would end up like Vital.

Nobody deserves that do they?

Quite so.

On topic.

Tactics.  4.2.3.1 seems to be the fashion.  Southgate deploying basically the same thing to compensate for England's lack of 'Italian Love' on the ball.

Similarly, Hughton deploys it in the absence of quality recruitment.  He may well have used it at Brighton and Newcastle where both teams scored loads of goals.

My ultimate view is one of deference to Brian Clough.  'A lot of nonsense is talked about formations.  Players win you games.'

And Forest don't have enough quality players.  As the last two results proved.

It really is quite that simple.

SA.

But said by the great man in an age when every team played 442.

[Portchester Tricky]

Just looked up Newcastle Uniteds 2009/10 promotion season. Looks like Hughton played a 4 4 2 Andy Carrol was a youth
academy graduate, and Kevin Nolan who was a midfielder scored 18 goals and Carrol 19 . . Although Newcastle got 102 points and had a goal difference of 55 , scoring 92 goals they had a massive squad, having been relegated the season before.
Statistics show that for 39 league games Hughton employed a 4 4 2, For 5 league games it was 4 4 1 1 and for 2 league games it was 4 5 1 .

All of the above suggests that he is not welded to a 4 2 3 1 at all. Could it be that he is only using this formation due to a lack of depth and variety in the squad Perhaps. I must say I am getting a bit despondent with his negative approach to games, but in mitigation, perhaps he really does know what he is doing, and is currently trying to keep us in survival mode until reinforcememts arrive. Saying that if we lose again on Wednesday, he might be walking the plank perhaps ?

[Strawberry Avenger]

Just looked up Newcastle Uniteds 2009/10 promotion season. Looks like Hughton played a 4 4 2  Andy Carrol was a youth
academy graduate, and Kevin Nolan who was a midfielder scored 18 goals and Carrol 19 . . Although Newcastle got 102 points and had a goal difference of 55 , scoring 92 goals they had a massive squad, having been relegated the season before.
Statistics show that for 39 league games Hughton employed a 4 4 2, For 5 league games it was 4 4 1 1  and for 2 league games it was 4 5 1 .

All of the above suggests that he is not welded to a 4 2 3 1 at all. Could it be that he is only using this formation due to a lack of depth and variety in the squad Perhaps. I must say I am getting a bit despondent with his negative approach to games, but in mitigation, perhaps he really does know what he is doing, and is currently trying to keep us in survival mode until reinforcememts arrive. Saying that if we lose again on Wednesday, he might be walking the plank perhaps ?

Good post. So he's deployed 'formations' at previous clubs in accordance to the playing staff at his disposal.

It's very simple.  Newcastle had a wealth of talent at this level.  And Forest don't.

SA.

[Strawberry Avenger]

People should appreciate the fact that this forum is monitored.

If it wasn't then it would end up like Vital.

Nobody deserves that do they?

Quite so.

On topic.

Tactics.  4.2.3.1 seems to be the fashion.  Southgate deploying basically the same thing to compensate for England's lack of 'Italian Love' on the ball.

Similarly, Hughton deploys it in the absence of quality recruitment.  He may well have used it at Brighton and Newcastle where both teams scored loads of goals.

My ultimate view is one of deference to Brian Clough.  'A lot of nonsense is talked about formations.  Players win you games.'

And Forest don't have enough quality players.  As the last two results proved.

It really is quite that simple.

SA.

But said by the great man in an age when every team played 442.

It's irrelevant.  The bed rock of formations is good recruitment.

His point is you need good players.  No matter how you set up.  And Forest don't have many 'good' players at all. And that's why Bournemouth beat Forest. If you eg. Don't have a fit or good player at LB? You'll struggle. If you don't have a competitive ball player at CM, you're left with the imbalance of 2 DCM (as per the overloading of DCMs with last Season's Recruitment.). Certainly, a lack of good players can lead to trying to use formations or tactics to stifle an opposition with better players than you. Cautious, sure. But it's always going to be damage limitation until you get better recruitment. It ties the hands of the manager.

Clough. He had good players.  Great players.  And would deploy backs to the wall tactics, counter attacking or free flowing football accordingly.

And Hughton is deploying 5231 in an age where it is 'fashionable' to do.  He stills needs quality signings.

And until Forest sign competitive players for the top 6...

SA.