(16-08-2021, 08:15 PM)SSM Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:04 PM)GaribaldiRED Wrote: It's reassuring to see that we have so many experts around (not only on this forum but on all social platforms) who know exactly what the issues are and also how to fix them. Apparently it's only CH and his team of coaches that haven't got a clue. How difficult can it be  :D

These types of comments always make me laugh.

What makes an expert? Living and studying something your whole life? Being good at something then managing it? Passing a qualification?

Gary Megson had promotions on his CV.  But there wasn't a man, woman or child in the ground at the CG who couldn't see he was running the club on a none-stop one-way journey to League 1.  Did he change? No.

I, like many other people love and have studied football my whole life.  I've played football to a good competitive standard and understand the nuances of the game.

Doesn't mean i'd be the best manager by a long way.  But it gives me an insight into the game.

Football fans, especially ones who take the time to read, discuss and seek opinion aren't idiots.  

I used to play football with a lad who is now a lead coach at Forest, and he was the single most useless player i've ever played with.  But he understands the game upstairs.  I've played with lads who were pros and represented their country and a couple of them couldn't construct some outdoor furniture let alone a team with anything resembling structure or organisation.

No-one is saying they're a better manager or coach than Hughton.  But it doesn't mean they're wrong when they criticise elements of what he is seeking to do. 

If half of the Government cabinet can be in the positions they are and make the decisions they make with their piss poor management of this nation, I think it's not unreasonable to think people are capable of understanding the nuance of football, systems and the pro's and con's of them, regardless of their status.

(16-08-2021, 08:40 PM)Marinakis Red Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:35 PM)Jean_claude_killy Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:08 PM)Marinakis Red Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:04 PM)GaribaldiRED Wrote: It's reassuring to see that we have so many experts around (not only on this forum but on all social platforms) who know exactly what the issues are and also how to fix them. Apparently it's only CH and his team of coaches that haven't got a clue. How difficult can it be  :D

Ultimately everything being discussed are reasons for him leaving Newcastle, Norwich and Brighton. So I'm presuming those clubs knew nothing and without a clue Gari?

He left Newcastle because Llambias wanted the job for his mate Pardew and it did not go down to well with the supporters, as reported at the time

"Controversy once again hit the club as Chris Hughton was sacked on 6 December 2010 following Newcastle's 3–1 defeat to West Bromwich Albion. The Newcastle United board stated that "the board now feels an individual with more managerial experience is needed to take the club forward".[7] Hughton's dismissal was an unpopular decision with the fans and the players,[8] and was highly criticized by many pundits."[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010%E2%80%9311_Newcastle_United_F.C._season#cite_note-10][/url]

To listen to the six fingered faithful in Norwich, Hughton was a disaster; strangely enough he managed them to their highest position in the PL since the 90's, a position they have not come close to achieving since.

Brighton is a different kettle of fish altogether; Hughton managed Brighton to the pitiful league positions of 15th and 17th during his two years in charge in the PL, whereas Potter, who many think is the second coming, managed to propel Brighton to the stratospheric heights of 15th and 16th place finishes.

He departed all three clubs when they were in the PL; his record in the EFL, you know, the league we are in, is second to none.

I'm more referring to the style of play which is very much the discussion amongst the majority of supporters. The style of play was the reason he left all 3 of those clubs ultimately. That is the topic currently, our style of play is very similar to all 3 of those teams. We have not won a championship match in 9 games it will be 10 if we do not register a win in that one. 

We have scored 12 goals in our last 16 championship games. That is not very entertaining by any stretch of the imagination.

(16-08-2021, 08:40 PM)Marinakis Red Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:35 PM)Jean_claude_killy Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:08 PM)Marinakis Red Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:04 PM)GaribaldiRED Wrote: It's reassuring to see that we have so many experts around (not only on this forum but on all social platforms) who know exactly what the issues are and also how to fix them. Apparently it's only CH and his team of coaches that haven't got a clue. How difficult can it be  :D

Ultimately everything being discussed are reasons for him leaving Newcastle, Norwich and Brighton. So I'm presuming those clubs knew nothing and without a clue Gari?

He left Newcastle because Llambias wanted the job for his mate Pardew and it did not go down to well with the supporters, as reported at the time

"Controversy once again hit the club as Chris Hughton was sacked on 6 December 2010 following Newcastle's 3–1 defeat to West Bromwich Albion. The Newcastle United board stated that "the board now feels an individual with more managerial experience is needed to take the club forward".[7] Hughton's dismissal was an unpopular decision with the fans and the players,[8] and was highly criticized by many pundits."[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010%E2%80%9311_Newcastle_United_F.C._season#cite_note-10][/url]

To listen to the six fingered faithful in Norwich, Hughton was a disaster; strangely enough he managed them to their highest position in the PL since the 90's, a position they have not come close to achieving since.

Brighton is a different kettle of fish altogether; Hughton managed Brighton to the pitiful league positions of 15th and 17th during his two years in charge in the PL, whereas Potter, who many think is the second coming, managed to propel Brighton to the stratospheric heights of 15th and 16th place finishes.

He departed all three clubs when they were in the PL; his record in the EFL, you know, the league we are in, is second to none.

I'm more referring to the style of play which is very much the discussion amongst the majority of supporters. The style of play was the reason he left all 3 of those clubs ultimately. That is the topic currently, our style of play is very similar to all 3 of those teams. We have not won a championship match in 9 games it will be 10 if we do not register a win in that one. 

We have scored 12 goals in our last 16 championship games. That is not very entertaining by any stretch of the imagination.

(16-08-2021, 08:39 PM)PsychoStanleyStone Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:04 PM)GaribaldiRED Wrote: It's reassuring to see that we have so many experts around (not only on this forum but on all social platforms) who know exactly what the issues are and also how to fix them. Apparently it's only CH and his team of coaches that haven't got a clue. How difficult can it be  :D

good also that some will be humble to revisit some of these threads and not just concede 'you were right' but all the how's, why's and where it goes wrong and where it all ends has been laid out in every detail.  Hughton is in a pressure situation, his thinking fixed, he can't change, same outcome as Sabri, maybe even to the exact number of games.  Though if you get of your huge high horse and read carefully you will see that we all wanted him to succeed, but he cannot change, it's like an alcoholic is always an alcoholic, once the pressure is on the same default behaviors click in.  The only way this sequence breaks is if Hughton discards his base collective belief system, like someone who can't swim and drowning, stepping back and teaching themselves to swim under intense pressure, it can't be done.  He cannot betray who he is, i respect him but he don't want anyone to get there monies worth, he doesn't care about the dads who've paid alot of money for his family to enjoy a game of footy and have something fun to celebrate.

(16-08-2021, 09:14 PM)GaribaldiRED Wrote: []

The reason for all managers being sacked are ultimately the style of play (usually).

(16-08-2021, 09:14 PM)GaribaldiRED Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:40 PM)Marinakis Red Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:35 PM)Jean_claude_killy Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:08 PM)Marinakis Red Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:04 PM)GaribaldiRED Wrote: It's reassuring to see that we have so many experts around (not only on this forum but on all social platforms) who know exactly what the issues are and also how to fix them. Apparently it's only CH and his team of coaches that haven't got a clue. How difficult can it be  :D

Ultimately everything being discussed are reasons for him leaving Newcastle, Norwich and Brighton. So I'm presuming those clubs knew nothing and without a clue Gari?

He left Newcastle because Llambias wanted the job for his mate Pardew and it did not go down to well with the supporters, as reported at the time

"Controversy once again hit the club as Chris Hughton was sacked on 6 December 2010 following Newcastle's 3–1 defeat to West Bromwich Albion. The Newcastle United board stated that "the board now feels an individual with more managerial experience is needed to take the club forward".[7] Hughton's dismissal was an unpopular decision with the fans and the players,[8] and was highly criticized by many pundits."[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010%E2%80%9311_Newcastle_United_F.C._season#cite_note-10][/url]

To listen to the six fingered faithful in Norwich, Hughton was a disaster; strangely enough he managed them to their highest position in the PL since the 90's, a position they have not come close to achieving since.

Brighton is a different kettle of fish altogether; Hughton managed Brighton to the pitiful league positions of 15th and 17th during his two years in charge in the PL, whereas Potter, who many think is the second coming, managed to propel Brighton to the stratospheric heights of 15th and 16th place finishes.

He departed all three clubs when they were in the PL; his record in the EFL, you know, the league we are in, is second to none.

I'm more referring to the style of play which is very much the discussion amongst the majority of supporters. The style of play was the reason he left all 3 of those clubs ultimately. That is the topic currently, our style of play is very similar to all 3 of those teams. We have not won a championship match in 9 games it will be 10 if we do not register a win in that one. 

We have scored 12 goals in our last 16 championship games. That is not very entertaining by any stretch of the imagination.

The reason for all managers being sacked are ultimately the style of play (usually).

(16-08-2021, 08:39 PM)PsychoStanleyStone Wrote:

(16-08-2021, 08:04 PM)GaribaldiRED Wrote: It's reassuring to see that we have so many experts around (not only on this forum but on all social platforms) who know exactly what the issues are and also how to fix them. Apparently it's only CH and his team of coaches that haven't got a clue. How difficult can it be  :D

good also that some will be humble to revisit some of these threads and not just concede 'you were right' but all the how's, why's and where it goes wrong and where it all ends has been laid out in every detail.  Hughton is in a pressure situation, his thinking fixed, he can't change, same outcome as Sabri, maybe even to the exact number of games.  Though if you get of your huge high horse and read carefully you will see that we all wanted him to succeed, but he cannot change, it's like an alcoholic is always an alcoholic, once the pressure is on the same default behaviors click in.  The only way this sequence breaks is if Hughton discards his base collective belief system, like someone who can't swim and drowning, stepping back and teaching themselves to swim under intense pressure, it can't be done.  He cannot betray who he is, i respect him but he don't want anyone to get there monies worth, he doesn't care about the dads who've paid alot of money for his family to enjoy a game of footy and have something fun to celebrate.

(17-08-2021, 08:05 AM)GaribaldiRED Wrote: CH has a hugely impressive record in the Championship before he went to Forest. Among the top scoring teams each season as well as conceding the fewest but I guess that is irrelevant as it doesn't fit the story.

(17-08-2021, 09:23 AM)Mcforest Wrote: CH is a good manager on paper for sure and even though I wasn’t one of those who was for him I figured he was we needed at the time someone who was going to make us difficult to beat and with any luck keep us up. Which he did. This season I’m hoping he would move away from crises management and just allow the team a bit more freedom to go forward and make life difficult for other teams. Go to win a game or take control of a game. But again we are seeing the don’t lose it and if you do lose don’t lose by a big score. You would just hope to see a bit more urgency during the games, be pro-active especially when a goal behind to 10 men with 30 mins to go. 
Now I know he pretty much has the same players and maybe he doesn’t trust these players to do more than sit deep and compact. It may well be true that our players, even one we consider good, are just not championship standard and CH needs more than 5 or 6 signings this window to make us competitive. That said I would have expected to see some sort of improvement just through a year of coaching and playing that system with the players if this is how he want to about it. The problem is we are not seeing that, if anything we are looking more disjointed, more laboured and even less interested in moving the ball at different speeds during a game. It is CH’s job to figure out why and to fix it.
I’m not saying CH needs to be sacked for us to go forward. I still hope he can move us forward but right now he needs to have a bit of a re-think and decide if he is playing the system to suit him or to suit the players. To me on the outside it feels like he is not taking the lessons from the last games and developing the team. Feels more like this will work attitude and we stick with it and I will prove everyone wrong. I hope it does but I’m struggling with it CH.

(17-08-2021, 09:35 AM)wassy04 Wrote:

(17-08-2021, 09:23 AM)Mcforest Wrote: CH is a good manager on paper for sure and even though I wasn’t one of those who was for him I figured he was we needed at the time someone who was going to make us difficult to beat and with any luck keep us up. Which he did. This season I’m hoping he would move away from crises management and just allow the team a bit more freedom to go forward and make life difficult for other teams. Go to win a game or take control of a game. But again we are seeing the don’t lose it and if you do lose don’t lose by a big score. You would just hope to see a bit more urgency during the games, be pro-active especially when a goal behind to 10 men with 30 mins to go. 
Now I know he pretty much has the same players and maybe he doesn’t trust these players to do more than sit deep and compact. It may well be true that our players, even one we consider good, are just not championship standard and CH needs more than 5 or 6 signings this window to make us competitive. That said I would have expected to see some sort of improvement just through a year of coaching and playing that system with the players if this is how he want to about it. The problem is we are not seeing that, if anything we are looking more disjointed, more laboured and even less interested in moving the ball at different speeds during a game. It is CH’s job to figure out why and to fix it.
I’m not saying CH needs to be sacked for us to go forward. I still hope he can move us forward but right now he needs to have a bit of a re-think and decide if he is playing the system to suit him or to suit the players. To me on the outside it feels like he is not taking the lessons from the last games and developing the team. Feels more like this will work attitude and we stick with it and I will prove everyone wrong. I hope it does but I’m struggling with it CH.

He doesn't have the same players though. He doesn't have a LB, Worrall, Soh, Christie, Garner, Grabban (at least fully fit).

Surely we are looking disjointed because we are missing the above?